Mr. Asthma » General Asthma » Diabetes cause
Diabetes cause
Question:
Only part of your post that I disagree with is the "just about." Most of them on both sides are scoundrels plain and simple. An honest politician is a rare thing, in fact it’s so rare that I can’t remember ever hearing of one that was scandal free when the digging got deep. 
— Cheri
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->of the planet. And Oh yes, I vote too. I don’t vote for people that I >consider dangerous. Sometimes due to the nature of things, I have been >forced to vote for the lesser of two evils. The Democrats hands are >just about as dirty as Republican hands on this issue. >Sleepy >"Thats All Folks" >Mel Blanc’s Epitaph
Response:
>I’m sure that made you feel all warm and righteous, but I’ll remind you that >there is no "they". >_WE_ are "they"! >Regards, >James the Elder
I was a little too young to have appreciated "Pogo", but wasn’t there a famous line that went along the lines of "we have met the enemy, and they is us"? Guy (Klose) — Guy Klose
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I’m sure that made you feel all warm and righteous, but I’ll remind you that >there is no "they". >_WE_ are "they"! >Regards, >James the Elder >I was a little too young to have appreciated "Pogo", but wasn’t there >a famous line that went along the lines of "we have met the enemy, and >they is us"? >Guy (Klose)
You are NEVER too young! I’m 48, Pogo was big before my time, but later I got his books. :-) Pogo is timeless! :-) Linda Join us in the Diabetic-Talk Chatroom on UnderNet /server irc.undernet.org — /join #Diabetic-Talk More info: http://www.diabetic-talk.org/
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You may be one of "them", but I certainly don’t consider myself one of > "them". >Then you’re deluding yourself. If you eat, void, consume, discard, breathe, >drive, pay taxes or damn near anything else you’re part of the problem, not >the solution. >It’s a closed system and we’re _all_ participants. thinking that there’s >some ubiquitous "them" on whom we can blame all of our problems is chidish. >Nothing personal Sleepy. >Regards, >James the Elder
Not taken personally James, Unfortunately, it is a fact of life, and therefore unavoidable, that we all must eat, crap and breathe. Though some have survived outdoors, and or nude, or semi-nude, we also require shelter, and clothing. No matter how "green", or "anti-green", or don’t give a rat’s pitutie (what the hell is a pitutie anyway, and how is it spelled? I use the phrase because I like the sound of it) one is, these are basic necessities. The ancients were smart enough to know, that you don’t crap upstream from where you drink your water. Why hasn’t modern society learned this? The most disruptive of ecological disasters are caused by human greed, pure and simple. We all know what the use of fossil fuels have done to our history. From the getting, shipping, refining and use of these energy sources, more deaths have been caused in this history of ours, than anything but religion. Why are the renewable energy sources that we all know are there begging to be used, completely ignored? You know as well as I do why. Why have all the mileage requirements for the auto industry been gutted? You know as well as I do why. Why are scientists and researchers bailing out of the EPA as fast as they are? You may not know this, but the politicos of the administration are censoring and modifying their reports. The last two have had altered to take out any reference to global warming. Why are we breaking, or not cooperating with, environmental treaties left and right. Have you seen the size of the ozone hole over Antarctica? Do you think that there may be a relationship between that, and the epidemic of melanoma in this country? Have you seen the ice core studies showing the degradation of air quality, and temperature over the last hundred years? I could go on and on, but I am sure people would prefer me to get off my high horse. Yes, I eat, breathe, crap, wear clothing, and have a roof over my head. Yes, all of these have an effect on the overall environment of the country. However, I have never made a living, derived income, or consciously did anything that I knew to be a factor in the degradation of the planet. And Oh yes, I vote too. I don’t vote for people that I consider dangerous. Sometimes due to the nature of things, I have been forced to vote for the lesser of two evils. The Democrats hands are just about as dirty as Republican hands on this issue. Sleepy "Thats All Folks" Mel Blanc’s Epitaph
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ><Childish, ad hominem attack snipped!> > but I’ll remind you that >> there is no "they". >> _WE_ are "they"! > Not more than, oh, 32 years ago, I wasn’t part of "they." >Why? Is that when you were born? If so, then your parents were part of >"they" before that. >Now you are, as is the rest of humanity. >The sooner you can come to grips with reality, the sooner you can begin to >help to clean up _our_ mess. >If you live in anything other than an agrarian economy in a third world >country (and not necessarily even _then_ with the ongoing desertification of >massive areas of China and the Sahara from over-farming and grazing) then >you’re part of the problem. Drive a car? Heat your home? Use electric >lights? Cook with gas? Where’s your water come from? More important, where’s >your sewage go? I already _know_ that you use a computer! You’re a consumer, >you’re part of the problem. >It’s a closed system. GIGO. >Thinking anything else, including that you’ve somehow opted out because >you’re "environmentally conscious", is naive in the extreme. >Regards, >James the Elder
It is *not* naive. If 250 million people all try to do a simple thing or two, to try to help the environment, the results would be spectacular. Something as simple as having tires inlated properly would make a 10% cut in gasoline usage. I won’t even go into SUVs. Sleepy "Thats All Folks" Mel Blanc’s Epitaph
Response:
> Remember POGO. The classic cartoon was the one > where he reported " I have met the enemy, it is us".
Yes Guy, I remember it well. When I was growing up Walt Kelly and Al Capp were required reading in my house if you wanted to know what was going on in DC. (My Mom was a closet liberal!) 
Regards, James the Elder
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You may be one of "them", but I certainly don’t consider myself one of > "them". >Then you’re deluding yourself. If you eat, void, consume, discard, breathe, >drive, pay taxes or damn near anything else you’re part of the problem, not >the solution. >It’s a closed system and we’re _all_ participants. thinking that there’s >some ubiquitous "them" on whom we can blame all of our problems is chidish. >Nothing personal Sleepy. >Regards, >James the Elder >Remember POGO. The classic cartoon was the one
where he reported " I have met the enemy, it is us". Guy
Response:
> I personally believe that the diabetes epidemic is a result of saturation > bombing of the sugar regulation systems of our bodies with all the refined > carbohydrate in our modern diet, especially sugar, white flour and pasta. > The USDA food pyramid with it’s solid foundation of six recommended starches a > day is especially helpful in promoting the epidemic. > Dan
I tend to agree with you Dan. — Evelyn "Be wise. Treat yourself, your mind, sympathetically, with loving kindness. If you are gentle with yourself, you will become gentle with others." – Lama Thubten Yeshe (To reply to me personally, remove sox)
Response:
> You may be one of "them", but I certainly don’t consider myself one of > "them".
Then you’re deluding yourself. If you eat, void, consume, discard, breathe, drive, pay taxes or damn near anything else you’re part of the problem, not the solution. It’s a closed system and we’re _all_ participants. thinking that there’s some ubiquitous "them" on whom we can blame all of our problems is chidish. Nothing personal Sleepy. Regards, James the Elder
Response:
<Childish, ad hominem attack snipped!> > but I’ll remind you that > there is no "they". > _WE_ are "they"! > Not more than, oh, 32 years ago, I wasn’t part of "they."
Why? Is that when you were born? If so, then your parents were part of "they" before that. Now you are, as is the rest of humanity. The sooner you can come to grips with reality, the sooner you can begin to help to clean up _our_ mess. If you live in anything other than an agrarian economy in a third world country (and not necessarily even _then_ with the ongoing desertification of massive areas of China and the Sahara from over-farming and grazing) then you’re part of the problem. Drive a car? Heat your home? Use electric lights? Cook with gas? Where’s your water come from? More important, where’s your sewage go? I already _know_ that you use a computer! You’re a consumer, you’re part of the problem. It’s a closed system. GIGO. Thinking anything else, including that you’ve somehow opted out because you’re "environmentally conscious", is naive in the extreme. Regards, James the Elder
Response:
>> I don’t think one has to assume conspiracy at all. We’re seeing the > consequences of greed. They paid no attention to the long-range > effects of what they were doing, didn’t even both to think about > them. The price is now being paid. >I’m sure that made you feel all warm and righteous,
Well, fuck you, too. > but I’ll remind you that >there is no "they". >_WE_ are "they"!
Not more than, oh, 32 years ago, I wasn’t part of "they." Priscilla — Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum. (thanks be to Brian Jones and topfive.com)
Response:
You may be one of "them", but I certainly don’t consider myself one of "them". Sleepy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I don’t think one has to assume conspiracy at all. We’re seeing the > consequences of greed. They paid no attention to the long-range > effects of what they were doing, didn’t even both to think about > them. The price is now being paid. >I’m sure that made you feel all warm and righteous, but I’ll remind you that >there is no "they". >_WE_ are "they"! >Regards, >James the Elder
"Thats All Folks" Mel Blanc’s Epitaph
Response:
> I don’t think one has to assume conspiracy at all. We’re seeing the > consequences of greed. They paid no attention to the long-range > effects of what they were doing, didn’t even both to think about > them. The price is now being paid.
I’m sure that made you feel all warm and righteous, but I’ll remind you that there is no "they". _WE_ are "they"! Regards, James the Elder
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I personally believe that the diabetes epidemic is a result of saturation >bombing of the sugar regulation systems of our bodies with all the refined >carbohydrate in our modern diet, especially sugar, white flour and pasta. >The USDA food pyramid with it’s solid foundation of six recommended starches a >day is especially helpful in promoting the epidemic. >I second this. >More of the insulin resistance gene and the diabetes gene have been passed >on due to the discovery of insulin a generation or two back (from my 50 yr >old perspective) and other advances in health care, and the profitability >of glucose-boosting foods have potentiated a huge number of the possible >diabetics who resulted. Presto! Epidemic. >Priscilla
It is usually accepted that health problems that happen after the age of breeding are not affected by the natural selection process. At least in the past most type 2 occurs in later life. The survival of those that fit the current environment is the rule I understand. If I had the answer I would not have posted this. It is worth a lot of discussion. Just raising issues. Guy
Response:
I would not expect a grand conspiracy. But I have seen improved products rejected because it would spoil a market. It is so common to say it is you fault. This is common in the consumer area. "You did not use the product properly". The truth is the product had latent defects and would failing light use. As far as the causes of diabetes, We seem to have no idea what is going on. But if we are an expert we must expound something. So easy to point at the patient. I cannot accept the current obesity theories even if they sound plausible.. Obesity is a bad thing for many reasons and should be corrected. The current flood of ads on diabetes and diets are not an accident. The problem that I see is we are on a detour and may be hindering the pursuing of a solution. Real conspiracies are not like a soap opry. They are very complex but deny product advances. Guy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>> But rather than a conspiracy, you might want to consider >>> that the chemicals we have filled our environment with – >>> both intentionally and otherwise – might be the REAL >>> cause of so many of our health problems these days. If >>> chemicals can cause frogs to be born with 6 legs, or fish >>> to be multi-sexed, they can certainly trigger insulin >>> resistance (and maybe even obesity) in humans. >>> FW >> Now *that* sounds like a conspiracy theory. However there is >> at least some truth in it I think. I believe there is >> anecdotal evidence linking environmental factors with the >> huge increases in asthma, and respiratory disease in the >> young. >> Of course you could fit these factors into the rich man >> conspiracy if you wanted. Who benefited by being allowed to >> help destroy the planet, instead of spending the money to >> keep heavy industry, the chemical industry, big agriculture, >> the petroleum industry, amongst others environmentally >> friendly. Gotta keep those Boards of Directors, and >> stockholders happy! >> Sleepy >Wow! I alway like good conspiracy theories. I watched a couple of old movies >the other night called the "Arrival" and "Arrival II" that blamed global >warming on Aliens. :-) BJ >May you hit on something. But I will have to wait a few years >until the senility get a bit more pronounced. Then I can >report on the aliens bugging me. It make as much sense as >a lot of things I see here. The TV seems to have hypnotic >effect on us. > Guy
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->But rather than a conspiracy, you might want to consider >that the chemicals we have filled our environment with – >both intentionally and otherwise – might be the REAL >cause of so many of our health problems these days. If >chemicals can cause frogs to be born with 6 legs, or fish >to be multi-sexed, they can certainly trigger insulin >resistance (and maybe even obesity) in humans. >Now *that* sounds like a conspiracy theory. However there is at least >some truth in it I think. I believe there is anecdotal evidence >linking environmental factors with the huge increases in asthma, and >respiratory disease in the young. >Of course you could fit these factors into the rich man conspiracy if >you wanted. Who benefited by being allowed to help destroy the planet, >instead of spending the money to keep heavy industry, the chemical >industry, big agriculture, the petroleum industry, amongst others >environmentally friendly. Gotta keep those Boards of Directors, and >stockholders happy!
I don’t think one has to assume conspiracy at all. We’re seeing the consequences of greed. They paid no attention to the long-range effects of what they were doing, didn’t even both to think about them. The price is now being paid. Priscilla — Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum. (thanks be to Brian Jones and topfive.com)
Response:
>I personally believe that the diabetes epidemic is a result of saturation >bombing of the sugar regulation systems of our bodies with all the refined >carbohydrate in our modern diet, especially sugar, white flour and pasta. >The USDA food pyramid with it’s solid foundation of six recommended starches a >day is especially helpful in promoting the epidemic.
I second this. More of the insulin resistance gene and the diabetes gene have been passed on due to the discovery of insulin a generation or two back (from my 50 yr old perspective) and other advances in health care, and the profitability of glucose-boosting foods have potentiated a huge number of the possible diabetics who resulted. Presto! Epidemic. Priscilla — Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum. (thanks be to Brian Jones and topfive.com)
Response:
Guy are you saying that peoople who are not diabetic are being diagnosed as such just so that the drug companies can sell drugs. I know I am a diabetic from my meter and I trust my doctor. Maybe I am misinterpreting what is being said. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> But rather than a conspiracy, you might want to consider >> that the chemicals we have filled our environment with – >> both intentionally and otherwise – might be the REAL >> cause of so many of our health problems these days. If >> chemicals can cause frogs to be born with 6 legs, or fish >> to be multi-sexed, they can certainly trigger insulin >> resistance (and maybe even obesity) in humans. >> FW > Now *that* sounds like a conspiracy theory. However there is > at least some truth in it I think. I believe there is > anecdotal evidence linking environmental factors with the > huge increases in asthma, and respiratory disease in the > young. > Of course you could fit these factors into the rich man > conspiracy if you wanted. Who benefited by being allowed to > help destroy the planet, instead of spending the money to > keep heavy industry, the chemical industry, big agriculture, > the petroleum industry, amongst others environmentally > friendly. Gotta keep those Boards of Directors, and > stockholders happy! > Sleepy >Wow! I alway like good conspiracy theories. I watched a couple of old movies >the other night called the "Arrival" and "Arrival II" that blamed global >warming on Aliens. :-) BJ
May you hit on something. But I will have to wait a few years until the senility get a bit more pronounced. Then I can report on the aliens bugging me. It make as much sense as a lot of things I see here. The TV seems to have hypnotic effect on us. Guy
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I am seeing too much diabetes. Three cases in people close to me. >The obesity theory does not fit what I have seen in this world. >I do know diabetes is a very profitable business. >I have seen many times where the pointing at the >victim is a standard business method. You >are a bad boy so pay without any excuses. >The media is flooded with expensive advertising and PR >campaigns about diabetes.. >I recently saw a paper where a doc said the flood of >vitamins and supplements probably has some unidentified >side effects. These items were not here during our evolution. >I would love to come back in about 500 years and read >the history of our age then. Another "dark Age"? > Guy.
I personally believe that the diabetes epidemic is a result of saturation bombing of the sugar regulation systems of our bodies with all the refined carbohydrate in our modern diet, especially sugar, white flour and pasta. The USDA food pyramid with it’s solid foundation of six recommended starches a day is especially helpful in promoting the epidemic. Dan
Response:
> Personally, I think the rise in diabetes has more to do with today’s > lifestyle than anything else. 100+ years ago the majority of the population > had jobs that required strenuous physical labor, not sitting behind a desk > pounding on a keyboard. Then there’s all the chemicals we dump into our > food supply, not to mention the air and water! Our technological advances > have made life easier, but have also cost us much. i.e.: rises in Diabetes, > Heart disease, Cancer, etc. It’s a double-edged sword and I’m sure not many > would care to return to the life of the 1800’s.
100+ years ago our life expectancy was much shorter. Many did not make it through infancy. The illnesses that cause chronic, "living with" problems today were death sentences then. Having effective disease interventions also plays a roll. I guess it’s a case of "the good, the bad, and the ugly." c
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> says… >I am seeing too much diabetes. Three cases in people close to me. > I assume we’re not talking about relatives, here. >The obesity theory does not fit what I have seen in this world. >I do know diabetes is a very profitable business. > Ain’t chopped liver. > However, before you go off on a ’secret cabal of rich, > ruthless men is doing this behind the scenes so they > can make money" rant, stop and ask yourself these > questions. > Is it logical? > Is it plausible? > Could such a plan POSSIBLY have avoided detection, or > had someone spill the beans about it, so far? > Most conspiracy theorists are so enamoured with their > theory, they refuse to realize they’re spouting > nonsense… >I have seen many times where the pointing at the >victim is a standard business method. You >are a bad boy so pay without any excuses. >The media is flooded with expensive advertising and PR >campaigns about diabetes.. >I recently saw a paper where a doc said the flood of >vitamins and supplements probably has some unidentified >side effects. These items were not here during our evolution. > Which is why many of our ancestors died of deficiency and > degenerative diseases, horribly, in pain, and before their time. >I would love to come back in about 500 years and read >the history of our age then. Another "dark Age"? > Well, there’s always cryogenic suspension… > But rather than a conspiracy, you might want to consider > that the chemicals we have filled our environment with – > both intentionally and otherwise – might be the REAL > cause of so many of our health problems these days. If > chemicals can cause frogs to be born with 6 legs, or fish > to be multi-sexed, they can certainly trigger insulin > resistance (and maybe even obesity) in humans. > FW
Personally, I think the rise in diabetes has more to do with today’s lifestyle than anything else. 100+ years ago the majority of the population had jobs that required strenuous physical labor, not sitting behind a desk pounding on a keyboard. Then there’s all the chemicals we dump into our food supply, not to mention the air and water! Our technological advances have made life easier, but have also cost us much. i.e.: rises in Diabetes, Heart disease, Cancer, etc. It’s a double-edged sword and I’m sure not many would care to return to the life of the 1800’s.
Response:
>But rather than a conspiracy, you might want to consider >that the chemicals we have filled our environment with – >both intentionally and otherwise – might be the REAL >cause of so many of our health problems these days. If >chemicals can cause frogs to be born with 6 legs, or fish >to be multi-sexed, they can certainly trigger insulin >resistance (and maybe even obesity) in humans. >FW
Now *that* sounds like a conspiracy theory. However there is at least some truth in it I think. I believe there is anecdotal evidence linking environmental factors with the huge increases in asthma, and respiratory disease in the young. Of course you could fit these factors into the rich man conspiracy if you wanted. Who benefited by being allowed to help destroy the planet, instead of spending the money to keep heavy industry, the chemical industry, big agriculture, the petroleum industry, amongst others environmentally friendly. Gotta keep those Boards of Directors, and stockholders happy! Sleepy "Thats All Folks" Mel Blanc’s Epitaph
Response:
I am seeing too much diabetes. Three cases in people close to me. The obesity theory does not fit what I have seen in this world. I do know diabetes is a very profitable business. I have seen many times where the pointing at the victim is a standard business method. You are a bad boy so pay without any excuses. The media is flooded with expensive advertising and PR campaigns about diabetes.. I recently saw a paper where a doc said the flood of vitamins and supplements probably has some unidentified side effects. These items were not here during our evolution. I would love to come back in about 500 years and read the history of our age then. Another "dark Age"? Guy.
Response:
says… >I am seeing too much diabetes. Three cases in people close to me.
I assume we’re not talking about relatives, here. >The obesity theory does not fit what I have seen in this world. >I do know diabetes is a very profitable business.
Ain’t chopped liver. However, before you go off on a ’secret cabal of rich, ruthless men is doing this behind the scenes so they can make money" rant, stop and ask yourself these questions. Is it logical? Is it plausible? Could such a plan POSSIBLY have avoided detection, or had someone spill the beans about it, so far? Most conspiracy theorists are so enamoured with their theory, they refuse to realize they’re spouting nonsense… >I have seen many times where the pointing at the >victim is a standard business method. You >are a bad boy so pay without any excuses. >The media is flooded with expensive advertising and PR >campaigns about diabetes.. >I recently saw a paper where a doc said the flood of >vitamins and supplements probably has some unidentified >side effects. These items were not here during our evolution.
Which is why many of our ancestors died of deficiency and degenerative diseases, horribly, in pain, and before their time. >I would love to come back in about 500 years and read >the history of our age then. Another "dark Age"?
Well, there’s always cryogenic suspension… But rather than a conspiracy, you might want to consider that the chemicals we have filled our environment with – both intentionally and otherwise – might be the REAL cause of so many of our health problems these days. If chemicals can cause frogs to be born with 6 legs, or fish to be multi-sexed, they can certainly trigger insulin resistance (and maybe even obesity) in humans. FW